When I see comments like “No Church is Perfect“, I always think why do people say that. Then It dawned on me that they do not know what is “The Church”. They seem to be thinking the Institutional Churches like TPM/CSI/IPC/AG etc as some Brokerage Houses(called Churches) which take you to God. Therefore, they want to know which Brokerage house(Church) is better. And TPM Clergy has fooled them into thinking that they are the best brokerage house(Church) and has special connections with Jesus to get you across. Their Dressing Style, Celibacy, Religious Traditions and psychological tricks which appeals to the Indian Mind has made people think their claims are genuine. So naturally, why would anybody quit the best brokerage house(Church) and join an inferior one? Huh…What a state to be in?
If I am not mistaken, those people have been brainwashed by TPM regarding the Church. As they have put on TPM Lens, they are not able to discover the true church of the Bible. They also did not read any books outside TPM Publications regarding the Church. I am not trying to find problems with people. But I am angry for what a Cult does to people, once they are in their grip. I was halfway making an article regarding exiting TPM. But then, I thought it better to help people know what is The Church(Ekklesia) before they know anything about exiting a CULT.
For the purpose of this article, I would like to define two terminologies so that, the moment you see any of these terms, you should know what I mean.
- Ekklesia – Ekklesia (and its alternate spelling ecclesia) is an important component of understanding the church. Ekklesia is a Greek word defined as “a called-out assembly or congregation.” Ekklesia is commonly translated as “church” in the New Testament. The word ekklesia is used to refer to the people who comprise the New Testament church. A few important points about the church and its purpose can be made here. First, the church is a group of people, not a building. The church universal is made up of all believers in Jesus. Local churches are smaller gatherings of the worldwide church. The Ekklesia is “called out.” 1 Peter 2:9–11 says, “But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvellous light.”
A Picture of Ekklesia of Christ - Institutional Church – These are human organizations that have camouflaged as the Ekklesia and has been successful in distorting the ekklesia by corrupting their relationship with the Head(Lord Jesus Christ). These are business houses which profits from the Division of the Body of Christ. As they are business houses, their structure resembles any corporate structure. We all know how TPM Structure is set up. Similar is the structure of other Institutional Churches. They might have some change of Designations and liturgies. Other than that their business model is almost similar. Let’s have a look at the Roman Catholic Structure.
Few Differences between Ekklesia and an Institutional Church
Though both are different in their entirety, some quick-to-spot differences are mentioned below. Basically, Ekklesia is a Living Organism and an Institutional Church is an Organization.
| Ekklesia | Institutional Church |
|---|---|
| Corrections of teachings always happen on the basis of scriptures. | The Organizational Doctrines made out of scripture twists are the foundation of their teachings. |
| Basic concern is for the poor and lost souls | The basic concern is for their own priestly class and their building projects |
| Every member is a Priest and is expected to minister as per the talent. 1 Peter 2:9 | The priesthood of all believers are not emphasized. The laity are more like spectators in a sport match. |
| Everyone has a ministry and they minister to the others as the Lord Gave them. 1 Cor 14:26 | Only the designated pastor and/or clergy are given the sacred right to minister to others. |
| No Hierarchy. Jesus is the Head and We all are Brothers. Matthew 23:8, Colossians 1:18, 1 Corinthians 12:12-20. There is NO CLERGY in Ekklesia | The Head is a Human and NOT Christ. They have layers of Subordinates who are reporting to their bosses. The Laity are the ones which are at the lowest level of the chain. |
| There are no designations and power centers here. Depending on the age and Maturity one may be referred as an Elder or Younger. 1 Pet 5:1-5 | Just as any worldly Corporation, here we can see designations and promotions as per their seniority and performance. |
| The Seniors Serve the Juniors. Matthew 23:11 | The Juniors serve the seniors eg. TPM |
| The Relationships between individuals are based on LOVE. John 13:35 | The Relationships between individuals are based on Power and Authority in the Organization. |
| Members will avoid differentiation as "Our Church" and "Their Church" as they recognize the only one Church of God without any divisions. Romans 16:17-18 | Members will refer to terminologies like "Our Church" and "Their Church" to specify the organizational affiliation |
It needs to be noted that TPM is not just an Institutional Church but also a CULT. It has other major issues than a normal Institutional Church. For some of those issues, please Click Here .
Conclusion
The above sections of this article should help you understand that you cannot equate TPM with Ekklesia. It is an Institution which CLAIMS TO BE THE CHURCH and has misled people into what Jesus has not called you to. If you are his sheep, you will hear his voice.
My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. John 10:27
If you are NOT his sheep, you will hear the voice of that White clad hireling who runs the Brokerage House. Jesus longs for a relationship with you directly and not through the Satanic Brokerage House.
Brother , Bible says we should be steadfast in breaking bread and also that we should be part of Lords table. . How can this happen if only a group of people assemble?
I did not get your question Brother. What stops the people who gather together from breaking the Bread?
46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart, Acts 2:46
I’m asking about communion.. I need a clarification as to Can we ourself take communion? Because bible says that we should be part of Lord’s table right. I’m out of this cult , but feel guilty that i’m not taking communion for last twoyears
Oh Ok…I understand what you say. Yes, absolutely you can take communion by yourself and also with your family and other believing disciples. Take a Bread just as Jesus did and remember his sufferings for you and break it. We are expected to do this in Remembrance of Him. Similarly with the wine. He is the Focus and not the Clergy as you might have assumed. The Breaking of Bread was a Daily affair. Now in these institutional churches, it has become a rare occassion. Please ensure that in the process you are discerning the Lord’s Body.
28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. 29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body. 1 Cor 11:28:29
Do you know what is the Lord’s Body? It is the Worldwide Church of God, the Ekklesia. The Bible is very clear about the fact that the Lord only has one body, and that body is sustained and maintained by His own life that flows into it from Himself, through the one Spirit He sent for that purpose. The unity and oneness of God’s people is as simple as getting in harmony with and being led by His one Spirit.
can you please send your testimony to admin@fromtpm.com
can withhold the details which makes you to expose .
A very good article, really for everyone to understand what is actually Christ’s Ekklesia ( gathering or assembly) is something different than so called churches . If we understand the difference between these two , we get clear picture that the whole heirachical system of churches is not doctrinal or not existed in first century church. Initially Episcopal Churches made this heirachy as pope ,priest or bishop etc…and later on pentecostals church copied in the form of cheif pastor, centre pastor, pastor , cheif mother etc.
So whole system is not scriptural.
Unfortunately for you dear Sony brother, the authority system existed from the beginning, well you can see that clearly in scripture” only if u read in a language best understood by you rather than using KJV ”
Well to begin with you said about 1 St century Christian, let me clarify to u remember admin posting about didache???
Dat is one of the oldest text written by the apostle correct . Plz read it for updating your knowledge regarding this matter..
Now tell me a very simple and straightforward answer.
WHERE DID YOU GET THE BIBLE FROM?
AND WHEN WAS THE BIBLE PUT TOGETHER AND BY WHOM ???
AND JESUS GAVE THE KEYS TO PETER SAYING – YOU ARE PETER AND ON THIS ROCK IL BUILD MY CHURCH !!!
WHAT DID JESUS ACTUALLY MEAN BY THAT.
Do u have any clue about all this .
@bro Xian
Sorry for interrupting.
Are you protestant or Catholic ? Just asking !!
Why do you wanna drag and bring catholic into this???
How is this even related to me being catholic ??
Let’s concentrate on what the sole purpose of the website is !
And just to clarify what actually made you think so much about catholic is it the didache or the Bible or Peter and keys??? M confused now ?
@ Xian
Obviously its Catholics who believe in controlling people of God (trying to establish authority from the beginning of 1st century). This hierarchial structure is established by Catholics among Christians (against commandments of Jesus). Tpm founder paul ramakutty established Catholic ministry and named it TPM. So if you are not Catholic, then are you TPM minister ?
@ nath
Haha hilarious , do you have answer to where you got the holy Bible from?
You said authority was started by Catholics in the first century????
Are you trying to say that the first century Christians where Catholics?? Why did your assumption limit me as a Catholic or Protestant?
What not TPM or an orthodox Christian?
Bro you need to ask the spirit of God for some wisdom to understand the scripture.
And as of authority Jesus gives authority to his apostles in many places ,you will know if you read the Gospels?
Take some time and read the Bible , not for the sole purpose of arguing or proof reading but to understand it as a whole rather than picking and choosing.
Jesus gave the authority to Peter by giving him the keys ,
This was the custom of the Jews , Jesus beinga from a Jewish background used those custom or tradition to make His point clear. Whatever you shall bind on earth shall be bound and whatever you loose shall be lost !
Hope this makes some sense to you.
And the question you had about me being a TPM minister. Fortunately I am not.
Was in the so called perfect bride( perfect cult) for sometime but now I am saved by the mercy of my Lord.
Well done Admin, another excellent thought provoking article which should help the lost in TPM to discern that they are being deceived. The illiterate and the people who do not have access to this information can be forgiven but to the ones who come here regularly, there is no excuse. They know that they are being deceived but continue living in this deception either out of fear or out they have lot to lose, maybe many of them who come here are the clergy.
It is because they love not the Truth
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 2 Thessalonians 2:10-11
The church is as physical as it is spiritual.Dont be confused.Read the bible.We are the church by the context that we are a self sufficient unit.But church is also a gathering of people looking to worship Father,Son and Holy Ghost.Definitely we need to go to church.Any church with the right doctrine per se.Which some do practise.Luke 4:16 shows that Jesus did Go to the temple and synagogue inspite of the fact that there were killers and Pharisees there.Admin please encourage people to go to the chirch and have a quest for the truth and probably correct one another in tpm etc for edification.One fellow here said something about anger as a sin in OT.All will start having there own wrong interpretation and create more 30000 denominations in coming years.All of them starting with good intentions bit later on starting to mint money.The reason behind any church getting corrupt is absolutely because of the laziness and inactiveness of the believers there.If clergy is wrong stand in unity and whip him out.Have the spine.Have the brain.Have the heart.
What do you mean by dont go to church admin.You have to take this article back or atleast re edit it.The headline is so wrong.Admin don’t give out wrong information.
https://www.openbible.info/topics/church
I have given a link of Biblical verses let alone the books of early church fathers.
Please take the time to read it.So many people got martyred for the church any clue?Any clue that Jesus himself did die for the church and that does mean a group of people who do attend the church.Not sit at home.
None of the verses you have quoted contradict my assertion. YOU DO NOT GO TO CHURCH. YOU ARE THE CHURCH. CHURCH(EKKLESIA) IS ALWAYS A LIVING ORGANISM. I hope you watched the video in the article.
In case you do not think I presented it nicely, you can watch this video also. I think the presenter makes the same point regarding GOING TO CHURCH
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNlgEg8TL14
Now that being said which is perfectly correct, next question which arise from is how do you take care of issues such as marriages or death where being part of a so called institution becomes a must. Like here in dubai any marriage in NTC is solemnised by the RC Bishop as only he has the license and so is death formalities. Not to mention such institutions are also subject to govt audits to maintain license. Our ex-TPM faithhome at RasAl Khaimah which has the license is such an example. Not that I had hold these as reasons not to come out of TPM but I am sure there will be people with such concerns. How can we balance considering that we have to follow the Caesar too.
Redeemed seriously?They depend on RC?And they shamelessly bash RC whenever they have a chance.Hypocrites of the highest order.
Brother,
Knowingly or unknowingly, you already answered it. In all my life I have never seen any minister(Except TPM) who has refused to conduct a wedding/Funeral because the participants are not of his congregation. The license is issued by the Government and therefore, they do conduct it. I know of weddings that was conducted by a TPM Pastor but signed and officiated by a Licensed minister of another church because the TPM Pastor did not have the license.
In extreme cases, such things are solicited by government officials as you might have seen in the testimony of a sister.
Do not worry about things like these to take a right stand for Jesus. These are worries that will be solved by Jesus himself. He is not a concept or a logic. He is the Living God who respects you for taking a stand for him. Do not be intimidated by these things which are administrative procedures. He will NEVER LET YOU DOWN.
Do you know how TPM gets death Certificates from Doctors whom they disparage and run down in many of their sermons?
1 cor 12:28,1 Tim3:1,2,1Tit1:7,Philip1:1,1 Tim3:10,13.What are these then?Im not saying we should go to tpm.Id rather say stay there for a little while get as many lost souls as you can and do join a church for spiritual edification.There are good preachers like zac poonen. Like Elijah thought he was the only one for God but realized there were a lot more who bowed not before Baal 1kings 19:18.Church hopping isnt wrong because you are on a quest for your own deliverance.seek and ye shall find.
Brother OB
If two families come together and pray, it is church. You don’t need organizational name for it,building made up of bricks, licensed pastor etc. All these are man made customs. Not all customs are wrong. But when you are in state where you find no good fellowship, then you can start praying together two three believer families. Keep in touch with other independent pastors for funeral place, marriage (license) and other formalities. They wont say no to you. Invite them sometimes, give them little respect and they’ll help you. It is not good to live in seclusion like TPM (life of separation) . In short church (ecclesia – called out individuals) is body of believers in whom the Spirit of Christ dwells.
In my case i have joined a small church having left Tpm. I just worship God, greet people with smile and come out. I don’t agree with what they do,but at least it is not cult, nor does it have Antichrist Spirit. By God’s grace I don’t feel need for any pastor feeding me spiritual food. I have that through preachers on internet. If there is a good preacher in town, ill go and participate meeting.
Hence in my opinion, it is not necessary to join any brokerage house. All you need is another Christian family for fellowship and church like atmosphere ( which we are accustomed to) gets in. I have seen many people grow into fellowship by humble prayer beginnings in their home. Initially it is tough. But finally God keeps adding people for mutual support (man being social animal).
Suraj read the bible please.why are there positions of elders,bishops and deacons even mentioned if you dont need them.If you are wrong admit it than tying yourself up in knots.Did the apostles gather two families?Seriously?Building made of bricks isnt important then why did Jesus go to the temple and synagogue?He should have stayed at home as you say.Why did apostles gather in houses just like they preached on the streets?If building isnt needed at all?You latch on to a couple verse and forget the rest.The church during apostles was a hierarchical structure.There were leaders.Just because we all are against tpm doesnt mean you destroy the whole concept of church.
Yes Brother OB,
The Basic Unit of a Church is an Individual. But The basic unit of a Fellowship(NOT CHURCH) is Two or Three Gathering together in Jesus Name (Matthew 18:20).
Brother, you think Jesus went to the Temple or Synagogue for Fellowship? Seriously? Fellowship with the Pharisees and the Priests There? He went to those places for Reasoning and Debating with the Religious authorities. The same was followed by the Apostles Time (Acts 17:17). His fellowship was with His Father Firstly and then with his disciples (John 17, Matthew 26:14-39; Luke 22:24-27; John 13:1-17).
Do you know that even in this present day, Christians have fellowships in open fields in remote places? They do not build any Church buildings, Have no hierarchy but they have fellowships. The place of your gathering is absolutely unimportant. It is the People who are important.
Brother Elder means being older in age and Maturity. It is NOT a position (1 Peter 5:1-5) like that of TPM where it is considered as a Clergy Position.
As old people, the presbuteroi or the elders became the prime group to guide the brethren. This was their responsibility. They were guides! The weight of age coupled with an exemplary life was worthy of emulation. These were the “elders” mentioned in the New Testament.
There was nothing of “rulership,” nothing of being “duly authorized,” nothing of an “eldership board,” nothing of “exercising authority”, nothing of “ministerial dignity,” nothing of “occupying a scared office,” ABSOLUTELY NOTHING OF THIS!
Bishop and Deacons were Overseer Functions( and not Authority Positions/Designations). These are again the Functions of Elders for overseeing the Ekklesia. Especially when the local ekklesia has many members. One important thing to know is that This is not an Authority Position over other.
We also see that these ELDERS/BISHOPS/DEACONS are not to serve alone, but in a plurality of elders. After all, every time that local church leadership is mentioned in the New Testament, we read that there are elders (plural) at a church (singular), see Acts 11:30, 14:23, 20:17 and 28, Phil 1:1, 1 Tim 5:17, Tit 1:5, Jam 5:14, 1 Pet 5:1-2.
With this in mind, churches should have a plurality of elders for their health and well-being unlike as in TPM where a non-local is send to a place to exercise authority and for doing a one-man-show.
And MOST IMPORTANTLY, these people are not deputed from Chennai or NJ or Brixton. They belong to that Local Assembly/Ekklesia.
Brother OB,
I’m observing that you are reading into article that which has not been said.
It is absolutely necessary to destroy the false concepts which have kind of replaced and superceded biblical concept. Those images which is more stressed comes to our mind than that which is hardly said. Concept of church as organizational building is widely used and people assume that we meet God in church and God has appointed x & y as brokerage agent to make us meet God. No wonder you find people going to pastor at the end of church to get prayed. All these wrong concepts need be taken out of way and hence admin has laid stressed of biblical definition of ecclesia rather than the definition which we humans have created. Hence these biblical definition must be given its due place and false notions needed be removed.
You better read article in this website titled “house of God ”
In Old Testament people used to think tabernacle and temple is house of God. It was so for God said to Moses – ‘ There will I meet thee.” But it was symbol of Jesus and our bodies and it pointed to its teal typology. When Jesus came he said, destroy this temple and raise it in three days. He stressed the fact that HE WAS THE TEMPLE where mankind can unite with God (have fellowship with God). In Jesus we meet God. So he was actually abolishing the concept that church is organisational building. Neither He nor his disciples ever made church as separate building for worship purposes. Church as place of worship is modern invention to undo what Jesus did. Tell me one place in Bible where Jesus and apostles established and builded a brick motor building and called it church ? Why don’t you give that money to poor and needy among you? You don’t give because of that religious spirit within you where you people think worshipping place made up of bricks is more important in sight of God than living organism who needs food and clothing. Come out of religious Spirit and be righteous. As admin pointed out, Jesus and apostles went in synagogue to debate and bring people out of phariseetic tradition. Synagogue was never asked in OT to be builded. It was phariseetic building. There was only one temple builded by Solomon ( reconstructed by Herod) in place of tabernacle made by Moses – which pointed to body of Jesus. “Hence church as building is not needed.” . Don’t waste your money. Give it to poor.
If you want to establish decon or bishop, do it. No problem. Article no where says that you do not need decon. It is against those brokerage agents that try to take place as mediator between God and man.
Teachers apostles prophets etc are gifts of Holy Spirit given for edification of group of believers gathering together. This is by WILL and mind of Holy Spirit (Not by human choice). So if two three families gather together in Jesus name, it is absolutely God’s sovereign chiice to decide whether certain gifts are needed or not. The position of bishop or decon is altogether different and might be needed when families gathering together grow in number.
What hierarchy? Read this verse – But do not be called Rabbi; for One is your Teacher, and you are all brothers. Matthew 23:8.
There are different roles in a fellowship. Some shepherds, some deacons. Everyone has certain role to play. You give honour to the least. Just as all the body members have different functions and the head is Christ alone.
Yes there are leaders also. There are ministries also but it all according to the gift given by the Holy Spirit.
Leaders will be accepted when they first become servants.
Admin then the image on top says dont go to church in bold and be the church in small sends out the wrong message brother.
Yes, the Caption is True. It is intended to be clear that you need not GO to the Ekklesia (CHURCH). You yourself are part of that Church. So you need not Go to a place called Church. Ekklesia is not a NOUN (Place, Building etc) which you need to GO TO.
You may have fellowship. But with or without the Fellowship, you are part of that Universal Body of Christ – THE CHURCH.
A christian is a church.
A fellowship of xians is a church.
Building is called church as a place of worship.We need the fellowship.If fellowship was not important like you are saying then the apostles in the numerous letters wouldnt have sent it to the church.i.e fellowship.They would have addressed to each people.They did send letters to churches i.e. fellowships.If people would have said we dont need to go to any fellowship.Then those days they would have not known anything about those letters.The reasin we have all that in a compiled form is because of the church.The Holy Bible that you quote today is compile by the church. I.e fellowship of 3rd century.So dont beat around the bush saying that a xian doesnt need fellowship.How many apostles have you seen not having a fellowship?They had a fellowship.That congregation is what is called as the church.Not the building per se.Not going to that church or fellowship is the opposite of what paul says in 1cor11:18,22,28.1 cor 14,James 5:14,Heb2:12,12:23.You started this site against tpm.But now it seems like its losing its aim.So stop doing a self goal by saying things against apostles and Jesus and have the guts to correct when you are wrong rather than being ego driven.
Brother, why are you mixing up two terminologies? FELLOWSHIP ≠ CHURCH.
Agree that You GO to Fellowship meetings. I would rather say, you gather together for Fellowship.
But you DO NOT GO to CHURCH. Because you are the Church/Ekklesia. You are an integral part of the Body of Christ(Church/Ekklesia). You never cease being the Church unless you recant your faith in Jesus and get out.
Ever thought of your thumb going to the Body?
Thumb is never out of the body to Go to the Body
Similarly every Born again Christian is automatically part of that Body of Christ.
For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body–whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free–and we were all given the one Spirit to drink. 1 Cor 12:13
Even if you are lonely and separated in Antarctica, you are never out of the Church of God (The Body of Christ).
Church is a State of Being and Fellowship is interaction between members of that Church. These Interactions in the Fellowship is mentioed in 1 Cor 14:26
Brother,
I suggest that you read some good theological books which clearly spells out the difference between Ekklesia and Fellowships. This happens if you are indoctrinated by selfish folks who want people to follow them. Accusing me of saying what I did not say is just being hasty. At no point, I said you should not have Fellowship. You are reading things which are not in the article.
Read these introductions and tell me if Paul assumed the Local Ekklesias as separate entities from the Global Body of Jesus Christ. I request you again to not just Skim over and comment. Read thoroughly.
7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ. Rom 1:7
2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their’s and our’s: 1 Cor 1:2
2 To the saints and faithful brethren in Christ which are at Colosse: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.Col 1:2
1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:Eph 1:1
1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:Phil 1:1
1 Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.1 Thess 1:1
Christians go here and there looking for “fellowship”. They participate in meetings, conferences, seminars, groups, and online discussion lists and email exchanges. To be sure these can be useful tools for bringing Christians together – but not if they are looking for fellowship as a “thing”, instead of the fruit of a Christ-centered life.
If fellowship with others is my focus then I am bypassing the Head and trying to have fellowship on some ground other than Christ. The Bible clearly teaches that “what we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that you may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ…if we walk in the light, as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another…” (I John 1:3,7a).
Fellowship is ordained by God as a means through which the Life of Jesus may be shared: “From Whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplies, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, making increase of the body towards the edifying of itself in love” (Ephesians 4:16). In other words, we are joined together to experience the Life of the Lord together. This is what makes us of one mind and one accord. Like-mindedness only occurs when we agree to “let this mind be in [us] that was also in Christ Jesus” (Philippians 2:5). Life is not in a meeting, or in a gathering, or in a way of doing things – Life is Christ, and Christ is Life. He is the Purpose.
So true fellowship is grounded in Jesus first of all. Fellowship with others on THAT basis is neither forced, nor orchestrated; it is effortless, spontaneous, and full of life. Fellowship naturally occurs because we have all seen and heard the same thing from the Lord – we are walking in the same Path towards Christ as all in all. We are in one accord not because we all look, think, and act just the same, but because we all, in spite of our differences, have God’s End in mind.
If we look to one another for fellowship apart from what we have seen and heard of the Lord then we are limiting ourselves to relationships with people with whom we naturally get along with. If we see fellowship as the reason for our existence as Christians then, ironically, we will never be satisfied. We cannot know one another according to the flesh and find contentment. We cannot properly discern the Body until we establish communion with its Head. Life is given and received as we stand with one another in relationship to Christ.
I think fellowship is necessary. We are the church, but we are all part of 1 church, the body of Christ. We don’t meet God in the end as millions of individual churches but as one Bride of Christ & hence we fellowship with others in the body of Christ.
Personally I don’t think it is appropriate to say ‘Don’t go to church’. It seems to imply that there is no need to have fellowship with fellow Christians. Jesus said that others will know we are His disciples because of our love one toward another i.e. love to fellow brethren in the truth. Something to think about?
Does the article ever say that fellowship is not necessary? You are mistaken for assuming that CHURCH=FELLOWSHIP. The fellowship is gathering together in the name of Jesus by a group of disciples. But to be the Church is to be an integral part of that Mystical Body of Christ. Please do not try to mix up your existing notions of the present day church system.
Therefore you Never GO to the CHURCH but Be the Church. Yes, You should/can GO for a FELLOWSHIP with other DISCIPLES. Now Please avoid any denominationalism when you have fellowship with other disciples.
The Basic Unit of a Church is an Individual. But The basic unit of a Fellowship(NOT CHURCH) is Two or Three Gathering together in Jesus Name (Matthew 18:20).
TPM teaches that Church attendance is a MUST if one has to be ‘caught up’
‘Fitly framed’ by getting together and doing work in the church.
As soon as 1.44 lac workers get perfected, believer counter is also closed and Jesus appears in the air.
So, in other words.. the coming of the Lord is more dependent on how many join the ministry and how soon can they reach the 1.44 target.
No wonder they are busy collecting money and building sheds.
Assuming that 400 join the ministry every year, in 91 years of its existence, the TPM Zion counter should be around 36,400. At this rate it will take another 300 years to reach the magic figure of 144,000.
Sleep on, o ye TPM for your lord will take his time.,
I think they already got the 1.44 L. So all they have got to do is collect money now.
Amazing article and the discussions/ comments are so enriching. Had we such open discussion at TPM , I think the organization would have got better. The saved and OB has genuine concerns and admin and Suraj has answered it beautifully. I am introspecting my life and getting better as a person these days. I’ve stopped being judgmental and I do not look down upon people who wear jewels. All praise and Glory to God.
Dear Admin, You have done a great job in helping folks to understand the difference between a church and a fellowship. It is very difficult for any individual who has been indoctrinated with the wrong concept of church to accept this. Church has been a word abused by the clergy for generations to ensure that the laity are under their control. A Church needs Clergy while a Christian fellowship needs like minded individuals whose sole aim is to glorify God and spread the Gospel.
Unfortunately many genuine fellowships end up as so called churches/denominations as false teachers and false prophets sneak in and take control using extra Biblical doctrines. It is the easiest and the most tax efficient way to make money. There is no turning back in almost every case as Mammon replaces God and the False shepherds make it a career for themselves and their offspring. In case of TPM, they were never Christian so forget about calling it a fellowship or a part of the Body of Christ.
TPM is so exclusive that they belong to another world – the kingdom of darkness. People even though they know this, are scared to get out of it because they think who will bury them, or who will marry their children or they will lose their earthly blessings.
A true Christian will entrust these burdens into the hands of their Saviour who has promised to never leave him nor forsake him. Let the true Shepherd lead His flock out even if it is a few.
It is true that some of the articles are hard to take in. This is because of the severe indoctrination that we’ve received since childhood in this mission. Some of the concepts indoctrinated are the pre- trib rapture concept, fellowship of the “saints”, communion, divine healing, wearing white and shunning jewels and colorful cloths, tithes, cutting off relations with those not in TPM or those who left, the exalted position of the clergy and finally the distinct places in the eternal habitation and its inhabitants. These habits are hard to be discarded. Sometimes, it takes us quite some time to reconcile on the veracity of the article. However, we are slowly getting weaned away from these twisted ideologies. Halleluijah! May the Lord give us grace to search the scriptures more diligently to know more of his saving love.
Open thou mine eyes, that I may behold wondrous things out of thy law. Make me to understand the way of thy precepts: so shall I talk of thy wondrous works. . Remove from me the way of lying: and grant me thy law graciously. (Psalms 119:18,27,29)
We are all so quick to judge without understanding the context or the whole picture. Painting the Admin as wrong and accusing him of scoring an own goal is a bit harsh because we were a tad lazy to read the whole message and as usual are hasty in our feedback. It takes real courage to call a spade a spade and the admin is doing just that, unfortunately our indoctrination limits our vision and we jump to our own conclusions.
Some of us think that we can bring about a change from within this cult by exposing individual failings, I think it will not happen as history has proved it multiple times. Look at the Roman Catholic Church, it is going strong even after the reformation, the Mormons are prospering like never before building temples all over the world including India and every morning I see the JW’s near the Railway station peddling their myth.
I think this site or any power on earth can bring down TPM or any cult unless God wills it. Having said that it is the duty of every christian to be a Light house, a city on a hill and use whatever ability or gift they have to spread the true Gospel. The admin is doing a great job and hope and pray that God will continue to keep him motivated and focused on exposing the heresies within TPM.
The material and the testimonies on this site is an unique source of confirmation to the ones who have already quit TPM assuring them that their decision was correct. It is also an invaluable library to the sincere folks who are searching for The Truth within TPM. I strongly believe that at this very moment as we speak, there are many individuals(clergy and laity) who are being challenged about their faith in TPM’s doctrines.
It is going to be slow but the lost in TPM will hear their Master’s voice and quit eventually. This site and the Admin will get his due reward in eternity. Praise God for giving this man the wisdom and the courage to use his time, resource and wisdom to create a wonderful platform for all to air their views without fear. The least that we can do is not become a stumbling block.
God bless you my friend, your labour is not in vain.
@Nmastf
After reading the article and the comments i didn’t feel/see anyone tried “Painting the Admin as wrong and accusing him of scoring an own goal is a bit harsh”. One or two comment said the image on the topic which reads ” DONT GO TO CHURCH ( big bold letters ) , BE THE CHURCH” ( comparatively small font ) send out a wrong message ( the DONT GO TO CHURCH part ).
I will agree with you/admin/author if you say , the purpose of the image in that way is to create a curiosity in readers minds “Hey what is he saying ….” which makes them read the full article ..
But we should agree with OB that at first sight it does gives out a wrong message.
The IMAGE could have been in the opposite way also
” BE THE CHURCH ( big bold letters ) , don’t go to church ” ( comparatively small font ) .. right or “HAVE FELLOWSHIP .. BE THE CHURCH “? ?
Even if you read article you don’t find the he word FELLOWSHIP at all. Only after the comment “about of image”, admin mentioned about FELLOWSHIP ≠ CHURCH.
OB didn’t say TPM is right or Clergy is right . Did he ?
So in your comment the phrase that some one tried “Painting the Admin as wrong and accusing him of scoring an own goal is a bit harsh”.. Were’nt you a bit quick to judge without understanding the comment or reason for the comment 🙂 ??
@Admin
I totally agree with you We as an individual is the Member of the Church, the BODY OF CHRIST.
In one comment “You GO to Fellowship meetings. I would rather say, you gather together for Fellowship. But you DO NOT GO to CHURCH”
a) Do you think everyone has a calling to start a House church?
b) What if there is no house churches near and around you ?
c) What will/should happen if a particular house church grows ( When families gathering together grow in number)?
d) Can/can’t this be House church / fellowships be associated to any existing church .. If yes how to decide which church?
e) If not who appoints the elders in house church ?
f) If not who will conduct baptism?
g)Regarding marriages / Funeral ( which needs a government licence ) i saw a comment from some one else that “to get in touch with some local denominations pastors/leaders “. Is this admins view too?
Recently i read about a fellowship in certain place where they preach that you dont go to any CHURCH , Be at home. Any oldest family member (male) can give holy communion to Wife, Children , grand children , family members etc . In Some other group they used PEPSI and Banana Chips for a communion. .. I am not judging them about their revelation/practice. They may ask “What is the problem ” ? What i mean to say is ..If there is no rules about the house churches/gatherings ( what to do / what not to do / how to do etc ) , i think it will result in
h) Cant be this fellowship in a building ( not house ) which is you are attending and has some XYZ name ?
i) Is there any problem in attending a church/gathering/fellowship ( XYZ/ABC ..name doesn’t matter ) as long as they teach and practice basic doctrines of Jesus ?
You mentioned ///”But you DO NOT GO to CHURCH …Ekklesia s not a NOUN (Place, Building etc) which you need to GO TO. ” ///
I personally know there are some churches/gatherings/fellowships started as House churches .. grown bigger beyond a house to a permanent building.. further grown… moved to a bigger building .. grown beyond a state / country and has some NAME and a word CHURCH in that name “.. Is this wrong ? Here word church is a NOUN isn’t it ?
In short its common that Christians term their worshiping/gathering place as CHURCH. Other religion call theirs as Temple or Mosques .. etc.
Thats why i felt the image/banner “DONT GO TO CHURCH” sends out a wrong message. ..
( NB :- I don’t deny the truth that real CHURCH , the bride of Christ is not confined to a single building ( or denomination ) .
Brother,
So many questions 🙂
I think I will address in a different article.
Thank you Brother. Thats alright.
Though I would respond back to the sections to me in another post, I would like to clarify a point you made about Fellowship. It might be true that the article did not use the word “FELLOWSHIP”. However, how would you like to analyse the below sentence from the Ekklesia definition?
The church universal is made up of all believers in Jesus. Local churches are smaller gatherings of the worldwide church.
Do you think the definition of Ekklesia was somehow negating the FELLOWSHIP Part?
@Admin ,
Agree with you … CHURCH the Body / Bride of Christ is universal and LOCAL churches are smaller gatherings and not confined to any denomination or NAME / BOARD.
BTW I don’t fight for any Board / NAME . When i reach heaven i don’t want to run around to find that Board/NAME and reach nowhere 😉
I felt there is a slight “out of sync” between you and readers ( some of us ) in taking the the definition of the word CHURCH . When you said the word CHURCH , you meant the CHURCH = Body of Christ / Bride of Christ only. ( Correct me if i am wrong ) .
But in common since the word CHURCH refers to Christian Worship place also ( i mentioned in earlier comment. Church is a common term for christian worship place , Temple for that of Hindus , Mosque for that of Islams .. and so on ) , i think atleast some of us who commented felt that the banner of the article “DONT GO TO CHURCH ” sends out a wrong message , when also thought in-terms of common naming conventions mentioned above. As i said earlier there are many buildings ( worship places : be it fellowships/gatherings or anything else ) with a word CHURCH in its NAME given to that ( very common in India atleast ).
Having said that but from the context of CHURCH = the bride / body of christ , i agree with you “WE OURSELVES ARE THE CHURCH” . “WE OURSELVES ARE THE HOUSE OF GOD” .
I think i have conveyed my few other doubts regarding Fellowships/local gatherings ( what ever we call ) earlier .
Well written bro ?
Very good article.
I know the difficulty in quiting this cult.
Even after leaving them, the old teaching will still ring on your ears,
And even they confused weather this is right or wrong,
Only prayer and holysprit can guide,
Pray sincerely for the light,
And pray that no man deceive you with the wrong scripture,
If you love the truth, god will help
Admin may god bless you more and more and help people to understand the truth.
God bless you all,
I smell a rat here. Just like yoga is good and the intent is deep of removing God and making yourself as God. This is what Bible also says that ye are God or God comes in us and we become one – the stage of nirvana or brahama.
Not that I’m defending my stand, but church is a place of fellowship amd worship. True, one can worship in homes and outside but I feel all needs to come to a place and worship in oneness. Besides worship, fellowship is also important.
Admin view will take us towards hindutuva type. No building or big gathering mandate, but be yourself or a small group you come across and start. But human psychology will make the small group to grow and again it will fall into vicious cycle.
My stand would be simple. Go to church and believe what God and bible says and edify others, thereby wrong opinions can also get clarified and all are benefited.
Brother,
Do you even realize what you are speaking? You seem to be a novice in TPM Doctrines. This Cult has specialized in So many Heresies.
Do you know that TPM according to their Doctrine says the TPM Clergy(144000) will Replace Holy Spirit in Eternity?
Imagine the Triune God is replacing one of them with TPM Clergy Group…What Nonsense. I feel pity, sorry and Anger at people like you at the same time.
Click here to read that.
@Mark, Is this a reply from to my Comments?
I think it would be easier if anyone responding can address the person whose comments you are responding to . ( ,,some thing like @admin, @ILJ, @OB .. example )
@Mark,
Bye the way from where this topic of Yoga came from ? Sorry i couldn’t really get the context / meaning of your comments you mentioned ..
////Just like yoga is good and the intent is deep of removing God and making yourself as God. This is what Bible also says that ye are God or God comes in us and we become one – the stage of nirvana or brahama.///
@ilj
When mark said, ///Admin view will take us towards hindutuva type. No building or big gathering /// then marks view is more Hinduism rather than admin’s. It is Hindu concept of meeting god in temple. I would rather say, it is found in all religions not only Hinduism, (except Christianity). Jesus has clearly put an end to this building mentality and people are still fighting to keep their temples intact.
Once their was such instance in life of Jesus. One woman began fighting with Jesus over true place/location of worship. She said our place of worship is true than your place of worship. To which Jesus responded, ” Time cometh when true worshipers will worship God in Spirit and in truth ” By this Jesus was referring to true worship of God by indwelling of Holy Spirit within us compared to worship that made people go to Temple to worship God.
I am still puzzled at OB and mark as to why cant they understand that church is not building made of human hands.
@ Suraj
You said Jesus put an end to this building mentality ?
What did Jesus say to Peter?
” thou art Peter and On this Rock I will build My Church and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it?? ?
Did Jesus actually say build my church ??? Plz refer Mathew 16:18.
So does it mean when Jesus says that the gates of hell shall not prevail against the church that Jesus is building on patros?
@Xian
Dear friend. There is nothing called “Church” in the Entire Bible. The Corrupt Translators translated Ekklesia to Church and that is one of the dangerous things they did on orders of King James. The earlier versions for Eg. The Tyndale Bible always Translated Ekklesia as Congregation.
Now if you change all the wordings of Church to Congregation in your bible, you will get the correct Perspective.
Thankfully many Indian Translators were more sensible than the KJV Guys. They correctly translated the word Ekklesia as “Sabha” clearly meaning the people rather than the Building.
So in case you have been calling Ekklesia as പള്ളി/गिरिजा , stop calling that way and address it as സഭ / मण्डली
Admin anyone who refutes you is a novice?
Was he refuting me? I thought he was commenting for “I Love Jesus”.
Q. Do you know why I said he was Novice?
Ans. Because he said this // Just like yoga is good and the intent is deep of removing God and making yourself as God. //
When TPM Itself is replacing the Holy Spirit with their 144,000 and he does not know that but telling somebody else is replacing God, it is Novice according to me.
How about you? I suggest that you don’t respond in haste as usual.
Yoga is bad.How about that does that feel like a not so hasty comment?
Seems you still did not understand my reasons. Who referred to Yoga? was it not Bro Mark?
I don’t think that brother “I LOVE JESUS” was even referring to Yoga or anything of that nature. But we all know that Yoga or many paths in Hinduism is oriented towards making an individual divine by their own efforts/Karma.
So if a person is referring to that part of Hinduism and pointing to him about Removing God and Making yourself God, without knowing the fact that TPM themselves are doing the same, what would you call him?
We always need to check our own yard before accusing somebody of something which we ourselves propagate or nourish.
1tim 5:17 elders are for ruling
How are we going to do this ruling? Seems you are caught up in the worldly definition of RULING.
Have you read 1 Peter 5:3 and Matthew 20:25-26.
1Tim6:4,5 take note of this please admin
1 Tim3 talks about positions in church.Why?If there was absolutely no need for it.
Can you please show me the text where such positions are said to be unnecessary by me? These are positions functions which are assigned to Elders. However, these are not authority Positions as among Gentiles.
Ephesians 4:11,12 again various positions.Paul didnt say you are church so stay at home and break bread
ADMIN YOU WILL LOSE YOUR CREDIBILITY BECAUSE OF THIS STANCE OF YOURS.PLEASE CORRECT YOURSELF.YOUR WEBSITE IS A POWERFUL TOOL.BE CAREFUL.
Im antitpm to the core.Just clarifying in the start.That doesn’t mean I will be fed with everything without verification.But you are behaving very weird these days admin.Actually I do feel you have stooges here.Your antitpm work is spot on and commendable but please dont give antibiblical thoughts and call it doctrines.Going to church is important.Church is a group of christians.We are a part of that group.A group called church.The church may have name or may not.But Biblically churches were identified on th basis of location(.Those days the church was in house and catacombs because they had no right to practise it so openly in certain circumstances.Today we have the mercy of our Lord due to which we can pray openly. I disagree making and spending massive money to build churches without helping the poor among them.)Anyway moving forward The elect among the church is the bride.Your stance feels very lutheran.Once saved always saved.Faith without actions.Sola scriptura.Your stance seems to be like that.Please cprrect me if Im wrong.If your heart was a s big as your head then admin would have been polite enough to change his misleading heading.You give clarifications in comments which again is opposing statements.I will reply you with verses from The Holy Bible only to show you why going to church aka group of believers is important.Fellowship has a deeper meaning.Its being actively involved in the church.The church is the group and the church will be gathering in a house or a orante building or may be in a hut.or maybe in a street.But this group aka church is followers of Christ only.Stop misinterpreting St Paul as was said by St Peter in 2Pt 3:16.@Admin i will suggest you to read theological books.But you need to start from letters of early church fathers. Like Ignatius of Antioch and many more.Start from there and you will come to better conclusions than reading theological books of 20th century.What do you think is more credible?A book written today by some theologian or letters not in bible 1000s years old.Rev11:1,2 may be physical or symbolic idk but yea it does say about checking if them (plural) are at the temple of god and altar.
@Suraj-The context of Romans 2 is not about ot vs nt.Its about greeks vs jews.Grow up man.Ot israelites were Gods people.Naaman wasnt an israelite.His faith bought him for healing.Faith with action matters.Just like abrahams faith .Now if you say naamans anger was a sin even if he was in ot where he wasnt an Israelite then somethings wrong with you.How many angry people in ot got leprosy?Seriously man?You can hold your opinion high but dont think its higher than the truth.Read Rom3.19,5:12-15 to know about pre ot and ot saints.Isa 53:4,6 ,Isa 38:17,isa44:22,Heb8:12,Heb10:14,17,18micah7:19,Icor3:13-15shows how they looked forward to messiah to be delivered of their transgressions.Read romans 3:25,Gal 3:22,2cor 5:10 stresses on actions.Dont tell me his anger outweighed his faith please just because you read two verses.Bible needs to be read in its context.Who said to whom and why.
@OB
I asked you simple question two questions. Just keep it short.
1) ” How will God judge people before Moses (those who had no law or biblical commandments). I mean on what basis ? ”
2) ” How will God judge gentiles who had no law (it was given to Israel) ? On what basis ? ”
Answer it and we will proceed. Give biblical reference.
Do you wanna take the throne of God ????
What is wrong with you ?
How typically of a tpmite to quickly think of God as a judgmental and waiting to punish his creation???
Have you ever heard of a Loving God!
I doubt cz if you knew the love of our Lord you wdnt dare utter such blasphemous statements??
And according to your questions the only conclusion that can be drawn is that you still don’t know what being a Christian means ? this is the effect of TPM on you ,sorry for you bro.
Do you not know?Or do you know.If you dont then I will tell you.If you are acting Ignorant I have no remedy for you.Again suraj read the Bible.Im a bot thats trying to put as many info as possible to counter your heresies.Lack of time and too many things on my plate actually is the reason of my poorly formed,punctuated Comment.
Bro OB
Please answer, instead of beating around the bush.
Btw if St Paul didnt think there was a need for church i.e group of xians he wouldnt have sent letters to each churches. And groups who call themselves xians would have not received letters from Paul because they would have stayed at home.Without any communication with Senior elders and apostles.Btw today we have a compiled book of letters we can read at our homes.So we are pretty lucky back then during apostles time.No Bible in compiled form.Back in Jesus time they had to go to synagogue to do the reading.So they did gather together.And their gathering was fellowship.But like today they had almost same problems of heresies,hypocrites and rebels.But mind you they didnt skip going to church.
Brother,
Why are you assuming things when all that the article did was DEFINING THE CHURCH PART 1?
I suggest that you DO NOT RESPOND BACK without Reading the Below.
The Below is the statement I made about Ekklesia in the article.
First, the church is a group of people, not a building. The church universal is made up of all believers in Jesus. Local churches are smaller gatherings of the worldwide church.
What part of the above is disagreeable to you and also let me have the scriptural references to your disagreements.
If you keep judging the Holy Bible with fromtpm lens or pentecostal lens or tpm lens you will misinterpret.You may subscribe to YouTube preachers or videos.But mind you it wasnt like that during early fathers times.Be vigilant.
Todays context isnt applicable to back then.You just cant judge Naaman or any ot saints or people on the basis of The Holy Bible ypu have today or even judging Adam by an isolated verse from Pauls letters by twisting it.Admin remember what happened to Nebuchadnezzar.He was raised to dispose one kingdom but he was overthrown because of his pride.Stay humble and dont play with doctrines.Or else you will end up being a rebel who instigated 100s visiting this site to start their own denominations and they will in turn start becoming heretics.
I rest my case.
@OB
Where are you going brother ? All you speak in haywire. Are you a bot who is oozing out words without any coherence to what is being said? Where did Namaan come in from in the discussion of ecclesia, where did judging Adam come in ? I though you were discussing about ecclesia or church. Brother calm down!
Ohh I forgot to mention, God only speaks to tpmites in their dreams , probably you cud ask one of them to ask God how he plans to punish and judge everyone ? Wouldn’t that solve your concern??
As per the expression in ICor 14:23 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers,….what does this translate to. It means there has to be a place where whole church is usually expected to come and congregate. Then again as per the expression in Heb 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account…..Does not this point to a elder who has a burden for the souls in the congregation. Well certainly don’t expect this congregation to be any where close to TPM, but certainly all this church must gather in a place which can be called Church as per the scriptures where at many places references are made to spiritual churches and literal churches. Having said that there are also two places where references are made to House churches Rom 16:5 Likewise greet the church that is in their house…..& 1Cor 16:9 (Both referring to Aquila & Priscilla). In one of the sermons by Capt. A M Samuel who was also against denominations said that they follow a practice where only 30-40 people congregate at a place lead by a elder. If this congregation grows they branch off to another place headed by another elder. Reason being Heb 13:17 where the elder must have burden for the 30-40 souls under his responsibility where spiritual fellowship thrive. I found this more hopeful and aligned with what scripture specifies. This is not possible with having 1000 + believers under a elder or Pastor who would have no clue as to whats happening …TPM being a shining example in this regard………
Redeemed is right
Suraj aka Nath-I wont reply you because since beginning I have noticed that you are a piece of work.You and anonymous are similar.At least he had some belief system.Yours is a baseless,self exalting rant whereby you want to mislead people.You somehow want to reinforce on people what your opinions are.Well not yours…youtube preachers…lol.I beat around the bush while you beat your chest.The heretic that you are, jog on.
Lol !
You know not the answer and hence you can’t. That Old Tpm believers spirit where you deny to answer , when you don’t have the answer is still there. I understand when u do beating around the bush.
Suraj aka nath.I’m not omniscient like you.Your answer lies in Luke13:28,29,Heb11T,Romans 2.
Tpm believers spirit ?what exactly are you talking about?Where did you read about a spirit like that?Haha joker.Jog on.
@ admin I have to say I do appreciate your sincere work through this website by trying to bring the truth to as many as possible.
You said that there is no mention of church in the Bible?? Seriously brother admin???
By that analogy everybody will say that there no mention of the word Bible in the Bible??
And when you translate a word from one language to another the word may sound diffrent but the meaning does not change!
The English is not the same as the old English , the Greek dat was spoken is very different from the Greek that is today.
Think about the time when the Bible was put together many words that v have today didn’t exist back then.
So stop thinking that what your understanding of the Bible today is exactly the same as the people who wrote it.
I cant respond to somebody who refuses to read the article in the right way and thinks it is something to be nitpicked.If you remove certain sentences from the context, such inferences are not surprising. Brother, please read it without any prejudices.
//Brother, you think Jesus went to the Temple or Synagogue for Fellowship? Seriously? Fellowship with the Pharisees and the Priests There? He went to those places for Reasoning and Debating with the Religious authorities.//
The same is followed by our admin…. He is going to TPM meetings and come back and write bad about them… Hypocrite… (By mentioning it, he is comparing himself with the Lord) Be warned of the condemnation of taking HIS glory… !!!!
// He went to those places for Reasoning and Debating with the Religious authorities.// You are Joking and justifying your articles with What Jesus did?
Did he go there only for reasoning and debating ??? Read Luke 19:47- “And he taught daily in the temple.” (தேவாலயத்தில் / ദൈവാലയത്തിൽ)
Brother, why do you take a bit of a verse and try to prove a point? This is what all TPM does and they falter.
Why not read the complete context?
45 ¶ [v]He went also into the Temple, and began to cast out them that sold therein, and them that bought,
46 Saying unto them, It is written, Mine house is the house of prayer, but ye have made it a den of thieves.
47 And he taught daily in the Temple. And the high Priests and the Scribes, and the chief of the people sought to destroy him.
48 But they could not find what they might do to him: for all the people hanged upon him when they heard him.
Surely if you read the complete context, you will know that Jesus was teaching against the doctrines of the Pharisees and that is why they wanted to kill him. Is that a picture of Fellowship or reasoning and debating?
BTW, Jesus did that right from the beginning. Read Luke 2:46.
And in case you thought the Apostles did not do that, Read Acts 17:17.
Last last sunday, my mother did not allow me to go to faith home as she thought that I’ll cause some problem. Last sunday, I went near Pastor to return sunday school syllabus and notes but he did not allow me to leave sunday school(as usual they like to impose their power on others). Head master of sunday school and other teachers are talking amongst themselves about me. One of them called me and said me that I must love the truth that I have learnt here. When I questioned him about the authenticity of tpm doctrine, he could not reply me. Today, some of them kept asking my mother abt me, and my mother, just like Pilate is washing her hands by telling them, “I don’t know anything. You directly ask her”. Someone said her, “Tell ur daughter not to interfere in Church matters”. As am wearing other color dress to that place which is called faith home, last sunday some girls asked me why am not wearing white. I said them that I don’t want to be like Pharisees anymore. Today one girl said me, “You are demon possessed, don’t come to faith home, go to Baptist Church”. I said her that I don’t have to go to any church since I am the Church. She said, o my God, devil is in ur head. Then one boy said,”Read Ecclesiastes 9:8, den come to Church”.
I know surely God is going to give me victory over this cult. Deuteronomy 31:6
Keep up the good spirit sister…They will surely run when you ask about the authenticity of TPM Doctrines and ask them to prove it on the basis of scriptures.
Wonderful! I’m so glad on the resistance you are putting up. Be strong in the Lord. He will give you the courage to withstand all such tactics of the devil.
Let me show you the double standards or cherry-picking!
The guy asked you to read Ecclesiastes 9:8 and then come to church. Which should also mean, read the preceding verse before coming to church. So let’s see verse 8 first and then verse 7.
8 Let your garments be always white. Let not oil be lacking on your head.
Very good. First check. Where does it say come to church ONLY, wearing white? It rather says, always wear white. Good. Second, does this boy go to school/college/office only in his white dress? Third, does he always apply oil on his head, without fail? (He probably might pass this check)
But why not check the preceding verse, before going to church?
7 Go, eat your bread with joy, and drink your wine with a merry heart, for God has already approved what you do.
Oh I know… Now it is symbolic, not literal.
Then why is verse 8 to be literally interpreted?? WHY?
And what you said Sister is correct. You are the church. I am the church. We, the born-again believers in Christ, are the church.
Please share the response to the above questions, if you get a chance to ask. 🙂
God bless you.
@ sis Lilly – wonderful – you are so very inspirational example of courage and godly zealously.
@ Santosh – haha – had he said this to you , he would have never dared again ?
Super Sister. hats off to you. I am in a position where I am forced to do this ministry because of his compulsion. But I don’t wear white or teach their syllabus. I teach what Jesus reveals me from the Bible. They knew that but still they don’t release me from this ministry due to lack of teachers. It is a babylon (TPM)for me since my eyes are opened. As bible tells obedience to my husband I go.
Well done sister. Me too when I left Sunday school ministry and tpm, wrote a letter with questions on doctrines no body replied and later came to know that since I questioned their so called divine Revelation, instructions given to workers not to follow up with me. When you questions their doctrine, that’s the end. No further discussion.
Blind leading the blind.